Paul’s Interaction with Thabiti Anyabwile at the 2016 Cross Conference
This will be the subject of tonight’s radio show: “The Elementary Falsehood of the Protestant Gospel” LIVE LINK: Friday 2.17.2017 @ 7pm
During Breakout Session
[BEGIN TRANSCRIPT]
PAUL DOHSE: I’m just trying to connect the message that I’m hearing constantly about the problem with moralism versus the practical application that you just recommended for sins like pornography. The financial stuff I understand, that once you get to a mission field you gotta be able to feed yourself, whatever, raise support. But I guess where I’m hearing conflicting messages is between the whole problem with moralism and um…but yet the tension between the practical application that you just recommended for these kinds of sins
And lastly, when we go to a mission field, what’s the gospel that we’re really trying to put out there? It seems like if you have a lot of sins issues, that’s a contradiction to the gospel, but yet this seems to be a gospel that says that whether you’re a Christian or not a Christian you’re still totally depraved, so… (Note: the last emphasised part was edited out of the audio posted by the Cross Conference on their website. This interchange begins around the 1:09 mark of their audio.)
THABITI ANYABWILE: No, no no. Let me give you some clarification real quick. That’s a very good question. I’m glad you asked that. I hope everyone’s clear that in this conversation here I was just setting out to give you some practical, sort of, thoughts, and points to think through in some practical areas that sometimes inhibit your participation in the mission. This was not a sort of workshop on the gospel itself. Right? So moralism is entirely different gospel. That’s the idea that by your moral behavior you earn sort of right standing or acceptance with God. We would renounce that as pharisaical, in fact when you read your gospel that’s what you see. Think of, uh, um, the man who comes to Jesus and says what must I do to have eternal life? Right? Jesus says something along the lines of go sell your all, give it to your poor. First he starts with the law, you know? He cites a couple of commandments and the young man says this I’ve done since I was a youth. That’s moralism. And Jesus says, I tell you what, go sell you all, sell all you have, give to the poor, come follow me. That’s the call of the gospel. Rich young man goes away sad, doesn’t he? So he was moral, but he wasn’t accepted with Christ, he wasn’t justified with Christ.
So, let me give two or three sort of words here. Justification and sanctification. When we’re talking about the gospel, when we’re talking about justification we’re talking about how it is we are made right with God, reconciled to him, forgiven of our sins, declared righteous with God, that is solely by God’s grace alone, apart from any works we do, through faith alone, in Jesus Christ alone. Right? It’s the work that Christ has accomplished, in His obedience to God and His sacrifice on the cross and in the resurrection that is the sole and only grounds of our being right with God, and we receive that righteousness only by faith in Christ. That’s the gospel.
However, those who are so justified with God also, if they’re genuinely converted, in fits and starts and leaps and bounds and stumblings and sort of up and down like the stock market chart, begin a lifelong process of sanctification, of growing in Christ-likeness, in growing in obedience to Christ, in conformity to Christ. Right?
And so when we’re talking about some of these questions about sin issues that keep you off the mission field, we’re talking about that area of sanctification, not justification, and we’re talking about sort of an artistic question about, in some ways artistic, in some ways Biblically clear. So for example if we’re talking about someone who wants to be a pastor in a missions context or pastor locally, 1 Timothy 3 defines that really clearly. Right? Must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, can’t be a brawler, can’t be a drunkard. Here he’s naming these sin issues and these righteousness issues. The Bible speaks to that very clearly. I think we want a similar kind of maturity in mind when we think about the mission field. So we’re talking there about maturity, not justification. Yes sir?
PAUL: So in defining justification, is justification a mere legal declaration in which the righteousness of Christ is also substituted for us?
ANYABWILE: That’s exactly right, it’s imputed to us.
PAUL: Or are we righteous as a state of being, through the New Birth?
ANYABWILE: No, I would understand justification to be, um, an imputation, um, and I would understand that there is a kind of growing in righteousness that’s a part of our sanctification. But this is where the protestant church is different from Roman Catholicism for 500 years. Right? So Roman Catholicism say the protestant view of justification is a legal fiction. That’s the language that they have used historically. Actually that’s what the Bible teaches. Romans 1:16, 17 so many other places, Ephesians 2:8-10, uh, and we could continue to add texts. So our justification is a legal declaration. It is forensic, in which Christ’s righteousness is imputed to us by faith. Right? We’re not earning it. We’re not made righteous in that sense, uh, at the point of justification, but we do grow in righteousness. Now I’m gonna pause you cause I’m already past time and we can talk further, but let me see if there is maybe just one other question from the students in the room and we can talk further.
[END TRANSCRIPT]
Follow-up in Hallway
[BEGIN TRANSCRIPT]
PAUL: Just one minute or so. In our discussion in there on imputation of righteousness, that would mean then that really the standard for justification , or the basis for justification, is perfect law-keeping.
ANYABWILE: Exactly
PAUL: Okay
ANYABWILE: Exactly, which Christ done. Matthew 5:17
PAUL: Which Christ did. I mean RC Sproul says that Christ actually gained his righteous status by keeping the law perfectly. Would you agree with that?
ANYABWILE: Yeah I would agree with that. Matthew 5:17. You know Kevin was talking about that a little bit this morning, speaking about that, I’ve not come to abolish the law and the prophets but to fulfill it. Um, and when you read the record of the sermon on the mount, when he says fulfill it he doesn’t seem to mean merely keeping the letter of the law but also the whole spirit. Right? So to fulfill it in its fullest sense. Or as to say, 1 Corinthians 1:30 or 31 where Paul says there that God made Him to be wisdom for us, that is, our righteousness, sanctification, and holiness. Um, so Christ has become all the holiness we need for justification to be fulfilled, so He is the reality [sounds like] for our justification.
PAUL: Yeah. I guess, and I understand that angle on it and everything, but then basically, as far as the gospel is concerned and missionaries, I mean, we’re there but it’s not us that’s really righteous at all.
ANYABWILE: Well that’s right. That’s right.
PAUL: Right
ANYABWILE: There’s a message that hey there’s a righteousness apart from the law that’s by faith from first to last. We’re calling other people to that foreign righteousness that’s in Christ.
PAUL: Right. So basically in cleaning up our act and going to mission fields, I mean, that shouldn’t be the emphasis, right? I mean that’s what cultures are gonna be looking for. They’re gonna be looking for character in missionaries. Okay. But the gospel is really stating that the fact that character is not in us at all.
ANYABWILE: That Christ is producing it…it’s not in us for justification…
PAUL: Right…
ANYABWILE: …but it is in us as Christians as we grow with Christ by a particular…
PAUL: But it’s really the one…Christ is really the one that’s doing it. When you say grow, it’s just an increased manifestation of Christ’s work, not us.
ANYABWILE: By the ordinary means of grace. Another phrase Sproul would want to use. By the ordinary means of grace. What’s happening is, like what Paul says in Colossians, right, Christ in you the hope of glory…
PAUL: Right
ANYABWILE: …that Christ is manifesting Himself more and more. And the normal way that He does that, right, is by the word, by prayer, by fellowship, those ordinary means of grace.
PAUL: Right
SUSAN: My question is…
PAUL: This is my wife.
ANYABWILE: How are you? Pleased to, blessed to know you.
SUSAN: When you say that Christ fulfilled the law, so when He ascended up into heaven, all law was fulfilled. What about all those he didn’t that have not yet been fulfilled?
ANYABWILE: Are you thinking of the prophesies and [unintelligible] like that?
PAUL: Yeah.
ANYABWILE: Yeah. So when I use the phrase “He fulfilled the law”, I’m mean in terms of our justification. It doesn’t mean that all of the scripture is now fulfilled. There’s still some things….
SUSAN: Right, I just didn’t know if that was something you said before…
ANYABWILE: It’s a great question.
SUSAN: …Old Testament law (unintelligible)
ANYABWILE: Something great Paul says to them in Galatians, Christ is the end of the law for justification.
PAUL: Alright, thanks a lot. Alright. Bye Bye.
[END TRANSCRIPT]


Why We Do What We Do Here at TANC Ministries
Whenever you feel like you can’t possibly make a difference in this world, remember the starfish.
~ Andy
A young girl was walking along a beach upon which thousands of starfish had been washed up during a terrible storm. When she came to each starfish, she would pick it up, and throw it back into the ocean. People watched her with amusement.
She had been doing this for some time when a man approached her and said, “Little girl, why are you doing this? Look at this beach! You can’t save all these starfish. You can’t begin to make a difference!”
The girl seemed crushed, suddenly deflated. But after a few moments, she bent down, picked up another starfish, and hurled it as far as she could into the ocean. Then she looked up at the man and replied, “Well, I made a difference to that one!”
The old man looked at the girl inquisitively and thought about what she had done and said. Inspired, he joined the little girl in throwing starfish back into the sea. Soon others joined, and all the starfish were saved.
The History of Western Philosophy and Its Societal Impact on the Church – Part 6
The following is part six of an eight-part series.
Taken from John Immel’s second session at the 2013 Conference on Gospel Discernment and Spiritual Tyranny
~ Edited by Andy Young
| Click here for part one Click here for part two Click here for part three Click here for part four |
Click here for part five Click here for part seven Click here for part eight |
We continue in our discussion of the major contributors in the progression of Western thought. Many concepts and doctrines that we have traditionally come to think of as Biblical orthodoxy in reality have their roots in ancient philosophies. Here is a brief summary of the thinkers and their contributions that we have studied so far:
Thales – The first scientific approach to explaining reality as opposed to a pantheistic approach. The concept of one universal “stuff” and its various forms.
Heraclitus – Because everything is in a constant state of “flux”, man is unable understand the nature of reality. The first to introduce a division of reality. Two “realms”.
Parmenides – Precursor to Aristotle’s “Law’s of Identity” and existence. Existence is real, but change is not. Change is only apparent because of man’s faulty perception.
Zeno – The Dichotomy Paradox. Movement was an illusion and plurality and change was impossible.
The Pythagoreans – Orphic mystics. Introduction of the soul/body dichotomy.
The Atomists – Described a mechanical model for metaphysical concepts. Introduction of determinism.
Sophism – Used deceptive arguments as a means of persuasion. “What is truth?” There is no objective knowledge. Man’s primary social purpose is domination.
Socrates – Introduced the concept of “universals”. Man’s ability to use reason to grasp universal concepts.
Plato – First successful comprehensive system of philosophy. Two world dichotomy, universals/particulars. Only philosopher kings have access to the realm of the “forms”.
This brings us to part six, and we will pick up where we left off.
Cynicism
These guys could be considered the first “street preachers”. In Christian parlance they were “evangelists”. They considered themselves humanity’s watchdogs. Their favorite pastime was to publicly expose the pretense at the root of everyday conventions. The believed that is was their life task to convert the masses to what they called the declarative.
They rejected all wealth, power, sex, fame, because these pursuits were the stuff of a polluted mind with internal haze. Diogenes of Sinope, one of the founders of the Cynic movement, is reported to have lived in a tub. He refused to wear shoes in the winter, refused to bathe, ran around the streets without clothes, and wandered from street to street in the cities preaching Cynic doctrines. Those doctrines were specifically designed to save men from the bondage of their flesh. If man was liberated from the bondage of flesh they would be liberated from worldly suffering and uncertainty.
The summary of Cynic ideology follows:
- The goal of life is mental clarity or lucidity.
- Freedom from internal haze, which signified ignorance, mindlessness, folly, and conceit.
- Achieving freedom by living in harmony with nature.
- Mental haze, ignorance, mindlessness, et al, is caused by false judgment of values which causes negative heartache, anxiety, unnatural desires, and evil character.
- Man flourishes (he truly lives) by achieving what is called “self-sufficiency”.
Self-sufficiency in the case of the Cynics refers to an internal indifference to life’s hardships. One progresses towards this life and clarity of thought by ascetic practices that help one become free from the influences of the flesh. And since they had a great disdain for fame, they tended to act shamelessly in public in a direct effort to slight all social conventions.
Here is the point I want you to grasp. How does man achieve harmony with nature? By being indifferent to all hardship. The suggestion was that the way man obtained this harmony was by constant arduous training of the body. You see this theme in the apostle Paul’s comment when he says in 1 Corinthians 9:27, “But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection…” Here he is using a reference that is influenced by the Cynics. (Editor’s note: While the expression might be familiar to his audience because of Cynic doctrine, Paul is using it in the context of a believer’s sanctification so as to not be disqualified from any heavenly reward he might receive at the Bema.)
Notice also how the Cynics have elevated the nature and importance of asceticism. Not only is the flesh bad, but the flesh must be defeated through specific violence towards it. This is crucial because it becomes a dominant theme later as we shall see.
Stoicism
Stoicism finds its beginnings in a school founded by Zeno of Citium in the early 4th century BC. Zeno taught in the public square located on the north side of the Ancient Agora of Athens. The name “stoicism” is derived from this square which was named ποικίλη στοά (Poikile Stoa) which means “Painted Porch”. The Stoics taught that destructive emotions resulted from errors in judgment. Someone of moral and intellectual perfection would not suffer such emotion.
Stoics were concerned with the active relationship between cosmic determinism and human freedom and the belief that it is virtuous to maintain a will that is in accord with logos. Remember it was Heraclitus who was the first to use the term logos. Aristotle used it to mean reasoned discourse. However the Stoics were the first to use it in conjunction with god. They said the logos was the animating force of the universe. It was this conceptual and linguistic shift that made the introductory chapter to the gospel of John possible.
Of course, later Christianity condemned Stoicism, but that didn’t stop them from using Stoic concepts and advocating the primary themes of Stoic metaphysics and ethics: an inner freedom in spite of worldly hardships, the innate depravity of man called “persistent evil” by the Stoics, and the futility and temporal nature of worldly possessions and attachments.
Stoic religion emphasized prayer, self-examination, and praise. They described spiritual pursuits like this: God is best worshipped in the shrine of the heart, by the desire to know and obey Him. Where have we heard that theme before?
The four cardinal virtues of Stoic philosophy where:
- Wisdom
- Courage
- Justice
- Temperance
Virtue alone was sufficient for happiness. A sage was immune to misfortune because he is dispassionate about all things both good and evil. Epictetus is quoted as saying, “Sick and yet happy, in peril and yet happy, dying and yet happy, in exile and yet happy, in disgrace and yet happy”
A sage achieved freedom by studying and seeking “universal reason”, which was their logos concept, and through practicing asceticism. Notice, now we have the correlation. Not only is it necessary to study this higher mystical concept, but it is specifically essential that the flesh is purged in the process. The flesh is beaten, and the study continues. Those who practice these virtues are enlightened and can achieve freedom from the vicious materialism and emotionalism of this world.
Stoics were determinists. They said that everything is subject to the laws of fate. The logos acts in accord with its own nature and governs matter. Souls are emanations from the logos and are therefore subject to logos dictates.
They describe the wicked man like this: he is like a dog tied to a cart and compelled to go wherever it goes. For you history buffs, you will recognize this from the Christian deterministic traditions that describe man like this: man is on the back of a horse being led around by the devil. This is Reformed Theology 101.
I want to illustrate how the Pythagoreans’ soul/body dichotomy weaved its path from their own relative hedonism to the Stoic doctrines we see before us. How did we get to the point where man must use violence against his own body to achieve enlightenment? And just so you understand, when we start talking about asceticism, we are not talking about giving up a few McDonald’s apple pies or a doughnut for breakfast in the morning. The accepted expression of virtue involved the literal beating of flesh as an ethical ideal
From the late 3rd century to almost the 1100s, here is what these people did:
- They sat on stone pillars until their legs rotted away.
- They drank laundry water.
- They slept on beds of nails.
- They inflicted on themselves personal and/or public floggings for sins.
This is the corruption implicit to these ideas. When you so divide man from reality, when you so divide man from life, you can only worship death!
…And that’s exactly where these doctrines trend.
To be continued…
| Click here for part one Click here for part two Click here for part three Click here for part four |
Click here for part five Click here for part seven Click here for part eight |
















Well, it compels everyone to fall to their knees, but with their hands behind their back and a bullet to the back of the head.
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