Paul's Passing Thoughts

Deb and Dee of Wartburg Watch .com: Gossip, Not Gospel; Hobby, Not Hope

Posted in Uncategorized by Paul M. Dohse Sr. on June 3, 2015

There is a huge problem with the Christian blogosphere; it is very comfortable with hopelessness. In fact, hopelessness has become a hobby. The real world simply can’t function without solutions, but the Christian e-world seems to be exempt from that reality.

I started this blog when most blogs that address trends in Neo-Calvinism started, circa 2009. The goal was to find answers and an eventual solution to the New Calvinist movement that continues to turn the church upside down. Perhaps my solution-oriented bent comes from my entrepreneurial background; without solutions—you don’t make payroll. I never had to face any of my employees and say, “I can’t pay you this week” because the possibility was too terrifying. Trust me, it was all about solutions for many years.

The problem is simple: the recent and ongoing tsunami of spiritual abuse is due to a false gospel which shouldn’t surprise us. That was my first goal; to find the “why.” Then I found the solution.

What is more obvious than the fact that the institutional church which some call, “the evangelical industrial complex of celebrity pastors” makes the ongoing abuse possible? What is more obvious than the fact that institutions cannot function without money? Take ABWE of the missionary kids infamy. GARB churches could have brought ABWE to its knees inside of a week; yet, even in light of unspeakable atrocities against children, not one congregation pulled support.  Hence, the situation dragged on and on for roughly twenty years with little or no justice brought to bear. Why? Where are the missionary kids today? Does anybody even remember them? Oh, I forgot, their situation isn’t trending right now; that would be the latest drama everyone is feeding on: Jordan Root and Matt Chandler’s Village Church.

The discernment blogosphere could stop spiritual abuse dead in its tracks. We are talking about huge numbers and people who have immense influence.  Why would you continue to give any credence whatsoever to an institution that makes abuse possible? Churches are either directly involved in abuse, or turn a blind eye to it. Pastors who dwell in the institutional church could indeed put a stop to it as well. For example, a handful of IFB pastors could have stopped the Jack Hyles cartel from wreaking havoc on innocent lives, but they didn’t. Why?

Obviously, it’s a preservation issue of some sort at the expense of innocents who are attending church and trying to do what’s right. Instead, they fall prey to tyranny and pedophiles. There is a reason why the Protestant church now bears the same fruit of the Catholic Church while both continue to thrive. How can this be?

Let’s pause for clarification of points:

  1. The Protestant/Catholic/evangelical industrial complex of celebrity pastors is predicated on a false gospel, specifically, the false gospel of progressive justification. Protestants and Catholics merely disagree on man’s role in the progression. False gospels bear bad fruit—this should be evident.
  1. Catholic/Protestant hierarchies both claim God’s authority on earth to oversee the progression of salvation. The Catholics are more upfront about the idea, Protestants less so; nevertheless, this ministry has a cache of quotations from leading evangelicals that make the same claim. And they get that directly from Calvin and Luther.
  1. Participants of the evangelical industrial complex of celebrity pastors knowingly profess progressive justification, or unwittingly function by it.
  1. Progressive justification calls for an institution vested with God’s authority to oversee salvation. We hear all of the time that formal church membership is synonymous with being in the “body of Christ.”
  1. Progressive justification, theologically, allows for any and every kind of sin under the auspices of authority. We simply must not question God’s anointed who “stand in the gap” and “stand in our stead” before God. Our role is “humble submission” before God. If those who stand in the stead have wronged us—they will answer to God, not us. Our role is to “forgive the way we have been forgiven.”

Break point: most discernment blogs are pundits of this system. Their only hope is in the system itself. This is why they refuse to associate ideology with behavior. Regardless of what’s going on in the “church,” the goal is to somehow fix the church. Since 2009, they continue to whine, cry, and beg the institutional church to behave itself. They gather together, moaning and licking each other’s wounds, crying out to the institutional church as god rather than the Prince of Peace.  Really, it’s pathetic.

The paramount example of this sad scene is Deb and Dee’s Wartburg Watch .com. In their attempt to save the institutional church, they have become a celebrity subculture that mediates between the hierarchy and Churchianity’s sheeple herd. They are also a model for most of the other discernment blogs.

Listen, when the focus of salvation is a system, people will cling to that system at all cost. It is NEVER the ideological foundations of the system; it is ALWAYS a few bad apples that are to blame. If you suggest that it is the system itself that is the problem, you better go to that conversation in full riot gear.

And yesterday was a good example. It’s an amazing scene. In the same way that celebrity pastors get a pass from their followers, Deb and Dee not only get a pass for their illogical ways and steroidal hypocrisy, but also, as I found out yesterday, a vibrant defense from their faithful followers. Dee, and probably Deb as well, stood by while I apparently got what was coming to me. And cursory observations of their comment streams reveal that they are selective in regard to who receives this verbal abuse.

There is no room here by any means to document the full brunt of their ideological disconnects and hypocrisy, but I will touch on the basics. Let me start with explaining their intolerance of me regardless of the following: the price I paid for asking New Calvinists too many questions rates near the top of the abuse scale, so why did Deb and Dee stand by while I received my verbal beating which included blatant false accusations and baseless name calling? Because like black conservatives who are not black because they are conservatives, I am not a fellow victim because I offer an articulation of the problem and a solution.

Besides the fact that Deb and Dee are not victims of the institutional church, an articulation of the abuse problem and a solution threatens their hobby; ie., gossip mongering. For years, they have held an endless recycling of trending drama in the institutional church with spotlighted victims coming and going. They have their own Top 40 hits of the trending victims that eventually drop down to number 200 or lower. The discussion held on their blog is the musical hit of the week until people get tired of it and wait at the doors of their Wartburg castle with bated breath for whatever is trending next.

But here is the bottom line: Karen Hinkley will not find justice any more than the missionary kids, and that’s NOT ok with me. Karen Hinkley is at the top of the chart right now, and the missionary kids are not even on the chart. Deb and Dee are comfortable with that because trending victims come and go feeding their hobby and celebrity status as hopeless gossip peddlers. Their gargantuan pooling of opinions has not solved anything and has actually enabled the institutional church to continue in tyranny and abuse. They are facilitators—not advocates. They only have talk and have no solutions. In other words, they offer no hope.

Let’s put feet on this a little more. Deb and Dee see no real power in the truth or a connection between ideology and behavior. The latter has been my primary problem with them for several months. In a venture to keep people connected with the institutional church in some way, shape, or form, they offer an e-church hosted by none other than Wade Burleson who is a consummate Neo-Calvinist.

Let that sink in a little. While supposedly taking up the cause of those abused by the New Calvinists, they endorse a New Calvinist, and make it a point to expose others to his teachings.

Really? Do I really have to expound on this further? Look, I could cite the lame excuse they present for doing this on their blog, but I can’t really muster up a mental incentive to do so. This comfort with metaphysical contradictions is post-modernesque in the extreme.

Now, regardless of the fact that I rarely, actually, VERY rarely visit other blogs, and the subsequent accusation by Dee’s minions yesterday that I am a “low grade troll,” I was beckoned to Wartburg yesterday in regard to a statement that she made which leads me to the next point. Since the obvious must be discussed in our day, it stands to reason that the obvious must also have need of being articulated. This speaks to the other problem I have with Wartburg: they do not see truth as efficacious to healing.

Let me be clear and make a statement that I fully intend to stand by: Deb and Dee believe a false gospel. How do I know this? Dee said so. The statement that was brought to my attention follows:

Remember, we are all positionally holy but we are all functional sinners.

This is clearly a false gospel that denies the new birth. In fact, it is a return to the same authentic Protestant gospel that New Calvinism is predicated on. Deb and Dee cannot help people victimized by New Calvinism because they are functioning New Calvinists and that’s exactly why they are hooked up with Wade Burleson which should be more than obvious, but anyway, it is what it is.

Sigh. Ok, let’s start with the fact that the biblical definition of a “sinner” is someone who is unregenerate. Really? Do I have to explain this? Do I have to point out that Dee called “believers” functioning unregenerates? Are evangelicals that far gone? This is the exact same gospel that John Piper et al hold to. He states it plainly all of the time: Christians still need ongoing salvation that can only be found in the institutional church. Furthermore, that also comes directly from Calvin and Luther both in no uncertain terms. Deb and Dee, as well as many of their minions, are well aware of this ministry’s numerous citations that establish this as fact, but…

…they simply don’t care about the truth nor do they see it as relevant, except for the fact that it threatens their hobby and celebrity status. Clearly, their problem with John Piper is primarily his tweets, not his gospel, and they have as much said so in the past. Why? Because they believe the same false gospel.

Christians, if they are really Christians, are not merely “positionally” righteous, they are in fact righteous beings because they have been literally born again of God. In the gospel according to Deb and Dee, there is no understanding of sin in regard to justification and sin under grace. UNDER LAW (the biblical definition of a lost person) and UNDER GRACE (the biblical definition of a saved person) are not separate—“Christians” remain under law and under grace is merely a covering supplied by a perpetual imputation of Christ’s righteousness. This is the New Calvinist false gospel that Deb and Dee buy into while claiming to be champions for those abused by the “Calvinistas.” It’s otherworldly ironic.

So in the final analysis, the Wartburg Watch offers no one hope—victims are only fodder for their hobby, regardless of their motives, and they offer no true good news, but rather replace the gospel with gossip.

paul

73 Responses

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  1. johnimmel's avatar johnimmel said, on June 4, 2015 at 10:45 AM

    dude… you are on a roll.

    ROTFLMAO

    Like

  2. Andy Young, PPT contributing editor's avatar Andy Young, PPT contributing editor said, on June 4, 2015 at 10:48 AM

    Argo,

    Here you go!

    We could make it really creepy and replace the art with an image of CJ Mahanney!

    Like

  3. Oasis's avatar Oasis said, on June 4, 2015 at 11:06 AM

    Pearl, Oasis is far too insignificant to ban.
    🙂

    Like

  4. A Mom's avatar A Mom said, on June 4, 2015 at 11:12 AM

    Clockwork Angel,

    Question. Who are you saying thinks fornication is A-okay?

    I thought you were referring to Argo with the Arian comment. Then you later clarified it was David B. I agree, “firing in the wrong direction” or broad direction is not helpful.

    If you are going to point, then name names. Clarify please. Otherwise, you are taking the “shotgun, mow ’em all down” approach.

    I am not a follower of Paul or anyone here. I find certain ideas of theirs helpful, others not so much. I comment on both & make known what I think, by agreeing or disagreeing & stating why. That seems to be okay so far. I haven’t been censored. Anyhow, look & verify thru comments yourself to see if what I’m saying is true. This is also true at Julie Anne’s blog where I have also commented. Check there as well.

    Curiously, in my experience, not so much at TWW. For instance, I made a comment once & Dee or Deb shut down comments immediately after. Why? Their comment after mine stated my comment was weird (or something like that) & so they were closing comments on that day’s post. Also, my comments seem to get “hung up”.

    It seems most who comment on Paul’s blog are viewed negatively by the Deebs. With a few exceptions, like Lydia. Although maybe she’s been on thin ice there in the past.

    It does seem that if you solidly disagree with reformed or Calvinist doctrine itself, then that goes too far with them. However, it’s okay to solidly disagree with it’s tenants like comp, pat, keys, sin leveling, discipline, etc. Even though this list is historically it’s solid platform AKA it’s gold standard.

    I am concerned that people who leave a “Calvinist” church for a reason on the list… will then pick another that looks good but is just as bad – because they don’t realize it’s the doctrine. It may feel like groundhog day until it clicks that it’s the doctrine itself.

    What I’m saying is the doctrine, at minimum, naturally leads to awful thinking. For instance this – God “sovereignly” decides when abuse is to stop. Think about the msg this sends to abused about who God is…… Just awful trampling of abused with this idea of God.

    I hope Karen, the lady being discussed at TWW, steers clear of the doctrine itself. I hope she realizes a “sovereign, control God” is a misrepresentation of God, & how it deeply hurts those who have been abused.

    Like

    • Paul M. Dohse Sr.'s avatar Paul M. Dohse Sr. said, on June 4, 2015 at 11:44 AM

      Well, we certainly agree on this…it’s the doctrine/ideology. Period. We may not agree on this: Dee states plainly that they stand by the “pale of orthodoxy.” Uh, that has to be the London Baptist Confession, Westminster Confession, etc., etc. Hence, game over. It’s a low octane version of the same poison.

      Like

  5. A Mom's avatar A Mom said, on June 4, 2015 at 12:41 PM

    “My authority has been peer reviewed”

    Ha! Goodness gracious. I, too, am rofl.

    Flat earth? Calculation of lift? Widely accepted, but wrong.

    Critical thinking. Questions should be encouraged. Debate is good. If the idea is valid, it can handle scrutiny with a fine-toothed comb. Questions, disagreement, & debate were punished in Calvin’s Geneva. Same in most churches today. Karen Hinkley can write a primer on this, I’m sure. I hope she sees the doctrine=root, not just the behavior=fruit.

    Like

    • Paul M. Dohse Sr.'s avatar Paul M. Dohse Sr. said, on June 4, 2015 at 12:52 PM

      Right Mom this is what makes me want to jump in the river–this whole idea that you fix abuse by correcting the behavior. Deb and Dee think the institutional church needs a BandAid. No, Christ’s assembly was NEVER meant to be a top down institution, but rather a cooperative body under one head striving for the same mind in Christ. It is a body of priests under ONE Lord. That doesn’t mean there isn’t leadership, but leadership leads–it doesn’t command. Institutions necessarily require horizontal authority and that’s where the problems arise.

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  6. A Mom's avatar A Mom said, on June 4, 2015 at 2:22 PM

    Karen Hinkley was right to stand her ground. She is an adult who should make up her own mind in matters of finance, marriage, work, etc. This is the issue I think that’s missed. Churches are practicing a form of slavery & if you don’t do what they tell you to do, then you are in BIG trouble. A real modern-day form of slavery. That is the issue.

    It is an epidemic b/c it’s ingrained in churchfolk. We have been brainwashed to think we need a stamp of approval from someone else. We do not! This is not how Jesus wanted us to live.

    My thoughts go out to the countless who have been treated like slaves. They need to know that no one: no pastor, elder, friend has the right to tell them how to live their life. You have the right to walk away & you can walk away.

    I feel dreadful for Karen & anyone who has been treated like a slave & not a grownup. A loving, saving, powerful creator God is not sovereign or controlling. God has given individuals choice & thus people are responsible for their own actions – not God. Justin is 100% responsible, not God. Karen took the steps she took because deep down she believed this to be true. Her action goes against the belief of a “sovereign God & elders who choose for her so outcome will ALWAYS be right”. God is not responsible. God does not choose for us.

    I hope Karen sues. I hope she knows that until the money dries up, she will still be one of many before & after her. I hope the attempted slavery over her motivates her to stop this modern day slavery of all ages. Kids are not safe in these “Corporation” churches either, imo.

    I hope people wise up to this form of slavery & stop handing their money over. How bad does it have to get?

    Like

    • Paul M. Dohse Sr.'s avatar Paul M. Dohse Sr. said, on June 4, 2015 at 2:40 PM

      It may get infinitely worse. It makes no difference. The institutional church magical yellow bus may have dents and scratches, nasty seats, and dead people underneath, but it’s the only bus going to heaven. Present sin separates us from justification, and the only place that forgiveness can be reissued is under the authority of elders ordained by the church. THAT’S CALVIN, THAT’S LUTHER, THAT’S THE REFORMATION. Do the math from there–the equation is not difficult.

      Like

  7. A Mom's avatar A Mom said, on June 4, 2015 at 2:54 PM

    “–this whole idea that you fix abuse by correcting the behavior.”

    Yes, it greatly worries me as well.

    What are we doing by telling them what to do? What repentance looks like? Why are we helping them become better manipulators? A hone-your-skills workshop? Again, this is either gross denial or a pretend game. These hotshots want slaves, not relationships.

    I believe people know what they’re doing. Even most kids know. And they know how to get back in good graces. It’s a matter of whether they want to or not.

    We don’t tell a thief – Don’t steal. They know that. What we do is say – Here’s your punishment for stealing. However, the hotshots know the slave covenants are one-way. There is no punishment for their slave control tactics. In their system, all they know is money talks. So let them hear your feet walk. 😉

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    • Paul M. Dohse Sr.'s avatar Paul M. Dohse Sr. said, on June 4, 2015 at 3:04 PM

      How can there be an institutional church on the highway every 3 miles with a $400,000 annual budget? Easy, that’s where you get your salvation. How much would you pay for eternal life?

      Like

  8. Andy Young, PPT contributing editor's avatar Andy Young, PPT contributing editor said, on June 4, 2015 at 3:11 PM

    Here again the solution is simple. I know it’s been said before, but I’ll say it again. Come out from among them and be ye seperate. Find other like-minded believers and just meet together for edification. Don’t try and reinvent the system. Don’t even try to fix the system. The system IS the problem. You have the spirit-given ability as a child of God and as part of a holy priesthood. You don’t need any authority or anyone’s approval. Your only authority is Christ. He is the Head. It is amazing what people can do when they are set free!

    And if you can’t find other like-minded believers, then you start making disciples right where you are. Exercise your God-given mandate to go out and make disciples. Don’t wait for someone else to do it. Evangelism is an individual mandate. That is how the body grows; when we as individuals go out and make disciples and make them part of our fellowship as members of the Body of Christ. The time comes when we simply have to stand at the door and shake our clothes and declare, you blood be upon your own heads, I am clean.

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    • Paul M. Dohse Sr.'s avatar Paul M. Dohse Sr. said, on June 4, 2015 at 3:31 PM

      As a guy who once worked for me often said, “There it go.” And it wouldn’t be the first time that it happened. It has happened a couple of times in church history; ie., a return to home fellowships. In both cases the movements came under severe persecution by the Protestant church.

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  9. A Mom's avatar A Mom said, on June 4, 2015 at 3:39 PM

    “Your only authority is Christ. He is the Head. It is amazing what people can do when they are set free!”

    Amen! Woo-hoo! These are life-giving words!

    Like

    • Paul M. Dohse Sr.'s avatar Paul M. Dohse Sr. said, on June 4, 2015 at 3:45 PM

      Right, just let the words in the Bible say what they say: “ALL authority has been given unto me, therefore…”

      Like

  10. A Mom's avatar A Mom said, on June 4, 2015 at 3:54 PM

    Clockwork Angel,

    Btw, I am a shady character since I read & comment here & there? Sheesh.

    Just because I like to wear batwoman t-shirts doesn’t mean I’m shady. Neither does my incredible t-shirt mean I’m incredible!

    I have an owl t-shirt as well. Seriously. 🙂

    Like


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