I think what continues to amaze me is represented in the “church discipline” box….members can not leave until released from counseling, and members can not leave over a doctrinal difference. This is America….just LEAVE. We did, and, to this day, we don’t regret it. Are there not ways to legally deal with harrassment, threats, intimidation, unwanted phone calls, etc? Fortunately, we were merely politely ignored. The surprise is that I thought I/we had a lot of friends there. Must have been mistaken.
Thank you, Paul, for continuing to make the NC teaching clear. Oh, I used to have a pastor (many years ago) who thought so much of Calvin that he gave the name to one of his sons. Now I understand why he was the way he was (sorry, awkward grammar – LOL).
paulspassingthoughts said, on March 1, 2013 at 11:32 AM
Jo,
Yes, most parishioners don’t understand the “redemptive church discipline” process. It is the integration of discipline and in-house counseling. When some walk away, the church is told that the parishioner fled the church discipline process by vacating membership.The congregation assumes the person vacated membership in-between the first and second step of Matthew 18. It’s deliberate deception using semantics. Also, most people don’t realize that Redemptive Historical teaching and preaching doesn’t really build godly friendships, but rather fosters loyalty to “the group.” It’s a form of nationalism that loves everybody, but not anyone in particular.
Hey, have you seen SGM “Louisville” new proposed polity manual? The intro sounds “humble” but the devil is in the details and vague language the philosopher kings must define. Scary stuff. I sure hope Al is not hoping to fund any SGM church plants!
“It’s a form of nationalism that loves everybody, but not anyone in particular.”
Thanks Paul–
That is exactly what I experienced in my 6 month stint in a NC church. Could not have worded it better.
Love love love in a general talked about way…but none ever shown to me or my husband. Ignored is more like it. Everyone is in their own little world yet in the group/all about the group. It was the strangest feeling/thing to see…I am sure I am not wording it very well, but I can’t really. The most cold, dead, strange, errie feeling. I was turned down in every attempt I made to volunteer or to be friendly. We lasted 6 months.
paulspassingthoughts said, on March 1, 2013 at 9:43 PM
Diane,
The doctrine sweeping the American church right now is “the centrality of the objective gospel outside of us.” It’s a form of Gnosticism that is communism in biblical garb. It is a complete emptying of self for the sake of the group. Self must become nothing, and the group is everything.
Reblogged this on Spiritual Sounding Board and commented:
Paul Dohse of Paul’s Passing Thoughts has worked up this great flowchart depicting how many hyper-authoritarian churches control their sheep. I think many spiritual abuse survivors will be able to identify practices shown on the chart. This is excellent!
“It’s a form of nationalism that loves everybody, but not anyone in particular.”
And who does that sound like? Papa Stalin. As they used to pronounce how he loves his people. And many believed it right through the pogroms. The collective is all important especially for the guru.
Problem: Christianity is about REAL sacrificial relationships. With Christ and with each other.In this movement, people are really seen as a means to an end: Power.
Yes, the “group” is all important. And bring more people into the “group” to please God. Who can argue evangelism is bad? Well, I can. I do not want people evangelized to Calvin. It is NOT Good News.
What is sad is how much people want to belong to a “group” or a movement.
But we have been desensitized. I can remember when I was a kid evangelism did not mean getting them to come to YOUR church. It meant sharing the Good News of Christ. If they happened to come to your church, fine. But the focus went from that to reaching the “unchurched” as if everyone in church was saved and ok. (The unchurched were really people who had stopped going to church when they became adults) Just get them to church and all will be well. But look at what church has become over the last 30 years. Marketing, building brand, celebrity pastors, shallow teaching, bizarre teaching, etc. It is like a soap company gunning for market share. Nowadays the worst thing you can do to a person is get them in church.
There is nothing about sanctification in any of this.
Paul's Passing Thoughts 
Reblogged this on Clearcreek Chapel Watch.
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I think what continues to amaze me is represented in the “church discipline” box….members can not leave until released from counseling, and members can not leave over a doctrinal difference. This is America….just LEAVE. We did, and, to this day, we don’t regret it. Are there not ways to legally deal with harrassment, threats, intimidation, unwanted phone calls, etc? Fortunately, we were merely politely ignored. The surprise is that I thought I/we had a lot of friends there. Must have been mistaken.
Thank you, Paul, for continuing to make the NC teaching clear. Oh, I used to have a pastor (many years ago) who thought so much of Calvin that he gave the name to one of his sons. Now I understand why he was the way he was (sorry, awkward grammar – LOL).
LikeLike
Jo,
Yes, most parishioners don’t understand the “redemptive church discipline” process. It is the integration of discipline and in-house counseling. When some walk away, the church is told that the parishioner fled the church discipline process by vacating membership.The congregation assumes the person vacated membership in-between the first and second step of Matthew 18. It’s deliberate deception using semantics. Also, most people don’t realize that Redemptive Historical teaching and preaching doesn’t really build godly friendships, but rather fosters loyalty to “the group.” It’s a form of nationalism that loves everybody, but not anyone in particular.
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Thank you!! Understood!
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Hey, have you seen SGM “Louisville” new proposed polity manual? The intro sounds “humble” but the devil is in the details and vague language the philosopher kings must define. Scary stuff. I sure hope Al is not hoping to fund any SGM church plants!
Click to access file.axd
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Lydia,
Will read, this should be interesting.
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Paul,
Did you secretly go to SGM? You seem to know them as well as I do. LOL
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Argo,
CJ was my twin brother in another life.
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“It’s a form of nationalism that loves everybody, but not anyone in particular.”
Thanks Paul–
That is exactly what I experienced in my 6 month stint in a NC church. Could not have worded it better.
Love love love in a general talked about way…but none ever shown to me or my husband. Ignored is more like it. Everyone is in their own little world yet in the group/all about the group. It was the strangest feeling/thing to see…I am sure I am not wording it very well, but I can’t really. The most cold, dead, strange, errie feeling. I was turned down in every attempt I made to volunteer or to be friendly. We lasted 6 months.
LikeLike
Diane,
The doctrine sweeping the American church right now is “the centrality of the objective gospel outside of us.” It’s a form of Gnosticism that is communism in biblical garb. It is a complete emptying of self for the sake of the group. Self must become nothing, and the group is everything.
LikeLike
Reblogged this on Spiritual Sounding Board and commented:
Paul Dohse of Paul’s Passing Thoughts has worked up this great flowchart depicting how many hyper-authoritarian churches control their sheep. I think many spiritual abuse survivors will be able to identify practices shown on the chart. This is excellent!
LikeLike
“It’s a form of nationalism that loves everybody, but not anyone in particular.”
And who does that sound like? Papa Stalin. As they used to pronounce how he loves his people. And many believed it right through the pogroms. The collective is all important especially for the guru.
Problem: Christianity is about REAL sacrificial relationships. With Christ and with each other.In this movement, people are really seen as a means to an end: Power.
Yes, the “group” is all important. And bring more people into the “group” to please God. Who can argue evangelism is bad? Well, I can. I do not want people evangelized to Calvin. It is NOT Good News.
What is sad is how much people want to belong to a “group” or a movement.
But we have been desensitized. I can remember when I was a kid evangelism did not mean getting them to come to YOUR church. It meant sharing the Good News of Christ. If they happened to come to your church, fine. But the focus went from that to reaching the “unchurched” as if everyone in church was saved and ok. (The unchurched were really people who had stopped going to church when they became adults) Just get them to church and all will be well. But look at what church has become over the last 30 years. Marketing, building brand, celebrity pastors, shallow teaching, bizarre teaching, etc. It is like a soap company gunning for market share. Nowadays the worst thing you can do to a person is get them in church.
There is nothing about sanctification in any of this.
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Got some good comments on my reblogged version of this at SSB. Go check them out, Paul 🙂
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[…] New Calvinist Procedure For Controlling Parishioners. […]
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